Learn Me: Helmet Ratings

So I'm hunting for new helmets. Looking for good safe ones. The three safety ratings I'm seeing are DOT, ECE, and Snell. I'm not confident in helmets that are DOT only. I've seen un-padded peanut shells carry that certification, and don't trust it to mean much.

In the past, with auto racing, I've seen Snell as the "good" one. Trouble is, seems like very few helmets are Snell rated, even what look like good full-face models. There are also a couple features I really like that do not seem to ever carry Snell ratings. In particular, flip-down internal sun visors (this is a heavily wooded area, so my rides typically take me between sunny and densely shaded sections), and the cool new Revu rear-view helmet.

So, what about ECE? More exacting standard than DOT, I presume. How good is it compared to Snell?

Is it worth sending a query to the Snell foundation and asking, "Hey, I notice you guys have not certified any helmets with internal sun visors. Have you noticed a particular safety hazard with them, or have you just not had any sent to you to evaluate?"

In the past, with auto racing, I've seen Snell as the "good" one.

It's an insurance requirement, not a safety requirement.

There have been a few lengthy threads on helmets in the past. Many will say that the DOT helmet is better, but the Snell foundation apparently changed their testing methods, so they're probably safer now.

Others will chime in.

There was a big article in one of the motorcycling mags a few years ago regarding the DOT vs Snell thing. I think that was with the M2005 ratings. I think the end result was that the Snell requirements were so high for higher speed hits that they had the potential to make the helmet less safe in lower speed collisions (like falling off the bike and your head hitting the ground). I'm not sure how much that was addressed for the M2010 requirements.

I have noticed that some helmets that once carried the M2005 rating now are only DOT rated. This could be because they failed the M2010 tests, or they just haven't gone through them yet. I wouldn't rule out a non-Snell rated helmet as long as it is from a reputable company.

Oh and if a helmet is ECE-rated, but doesn't have a DOT sticker, you might run afoul of law enforcement if you are in an area that does gear checks. Of course, you could just do what some of the chrome crowd does, and buy a DOT sticker to put on your helmet.

All of the helmets I have seen from retailers in the U.S. carry the DOT sticker. I'm looking at ones that would meet ECE and DOT requirements.

I've seen that article about DOT potentially being a better rating, I just find it a bit hard to swallow that this:

Is somehow safer than this:

So you're considering one of those beanie type helmets, then?

Here's some info about the 3 testing methods.

http://silodrome.com/snell-vs-dot-vs-ece-r22-05-helmet-standards-throwdown/

In reply to Zomby Woof:

Thanks.

Not interested in beanies. I like my chin in its current configuration and would prefer to not have a bee hit me in the face.

Definitely going full face, probably DOT&ECE certified.

I've read numerous articles covering the differences between the rating.

DOT is a self certifying minimum standard for the US. Lots of equipment that clearly doesn't pass any test has a DOT sticker on it. By itself, the junk equipment improperly self certifying compliance doesn't mean a good helmet with a DOT sticker is bad. Lots of very good helmets carry DOT only stickers.

SNELL started as a racing standard decades ago after a fatal crash. It is a very hard hit test, which is in the opinion of many a problem. The helmet has to be so hard that it can cause skull damage by transmitting the forces instead of absorbing them. Snell has many weird standards that cause perfectly good helmets to be denied a Snell rating. Such as the absolute ban on internal visors. No helmet equipped with one will even be taken in for testing by Snell. So, not having a Snell rating just really doesn't mean much. Having a Snell rating may well mean the helmet is so hard it might kill you.

ECE is the European rating. You won't see it much here in the US, unless you import a helmet from Europe. It's similar to a DOT rating in the US. Some differences, having to do with fitment and ventilation. The Nolan N43 for example, passes the ECE standards just fine, but had to have reduced ventilation for the DOT rating.

Now, if you're just trolling, so be it. If you can't tell the inherent differences between a beanie helmet and a full faced, regardless of the stickers on either, you probably shouldn't be shopping for brain buckets.

foxtrapper wrote: Now, if you're just trolling, so be it. If you can't tell the inherent differences between a beanie helmet and a full faced, regardless of the stickers on either, you probably shouldn't be shopping for brain buckets.

Not trolling. Can tell the difference. I was being facetious and didn't include a smiley.

Because I live in an isolated area, I'm probably going to end up ordering something from a good online retailer. The ones I have been searching on give all the certifications particular models meet.

I just have some issues with the DOT certification. As you said, there are many good helmets that are DOT-only. But there are also many clearly unsafe helmets with the DOT sticker. (I went into the local motorcycle shop catering to aging Harley riders. The only helmets they had were peanut shell beanies with NO energy absorbing foam inside at all, and they carried a DOT sticker.) So, I don't put much faith in it. I actually wasn't aware earlier about it being a self-test thing thus leading to unsafe helmets getting the sticker.

So, if I buy a helmet from a reputable company (Shoei, Icon, HJC, Shark, Scorpion, Bell, etc.), that appears to be well made, I can probably trust it to actually have been tested to the standards of the DOT sticker on it?

I am not a biker; I autocross (meaning M helmets are used sometimes too).

With that disclaimer in mind, I've never seen a Shoei, HJC, or Bell helmet skimp on safety if it's a full-face motorcycle model. At that point, it's more important to find a helmet that fits your noggin comfortably, but without wiggling.

Make sure your new helmet stays snug without compressing your skull or cheek-bones. If it's loose, it won't protect you well in a crash. If it's too tight, you'll have sinus headaches or be sore after riding.

If a company is capable of making Snell helmets, they're capable of making safe DOT helmets.

Also, if I decide to do track days on a bike in the future, what helmet standards are required for that? Or should I just not worry about that for a while since it will probably also require a hefty outlay for a fancy leather suit way nicer than the textile jacket and pants I currently wear?

from a prior thread
http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/sprockets/snell-vs-dot-helmet-for-motorcycle-use/47182/page1/

JoeyM said: How fast do you expect your crashes to be? If you like to keep your crotch rocket moving at near-triple digit speeds, Snell may be the way to go. If you just sedately cruse the boulevard, you may be safer with a "lesser" helmet because it will give more. http://www.westcoastweasels.com/archives/PDF/Blowing_the_Lid_Off.pdf

foxtrapper wrote: If you can't tell the inherent differences between a beanie helmet and a full faced, regardless of the stickers on either, you probably shouldn't be shopping for brain buckets.

That was the point I was making. I guess it slipped by.

I've always gone with the "go with a reputable manufacturer" way of thinking it might be stupid I guess come to think of it. I think my next purchase is going to be the hjc rpha 10, I mean if its good enough for Jorge Lorenzo and Ben spies it should be more than good enough for me right? (See racing advertising does work)

Beer Baron wrote: So, if I buy a helmet from a reputable company (Shoei, Icon, HJC, Shark, Scorpion, Bell, etc.), that appears to be well made, I can probably trust it to actually have been tested to the standards of the DOT sticker on it?

Very generically, I believe you are right.

That said, I also really, really don't like buying helmets mail order without having plunked it on my head to see how it fits.

I understand living in isolation, but I'd rather run a cheaper HJC I've tried on locally and know to fit vs a superior Shoei that, surprise!, doesn't fit all that well or comfortably. You can extend this to field of vision, ventilation and a whole lot of other things about helmets.

I've no idea what the track requirements are for motorcycles.

Unfortunately the local guys have basically nothing in stock. I was leaning towards going the next town over trying on helmets and if I find something that fits but lacks features buying a nicer model from the same manufacturer. Either that or wait until I get a chance to make the two hour drive to the nearest decent sized city. Which may be the better plan because I want to test ride a few bikes anyway.

The photochromic lens that's available for Bell Helmets is awesome. That, and the reputable manufacturer thing pushed me towards the Bell Star.

It's pretty simple. The Snell M2010 standard incorporated all of the good features of the DOT/ECE standards, the M2005 standard, and the "Blowing The Lid Off" test.

www.webbikereview.com has reviews of dozens of M2010 helmets; there are at least twenty reputable manufacturers.

If you want a loud M2010 helmet with a giant eyeport and giant, superbly effective vents, get a Bell Vortex like mine.

chaparral wrote: ...and the "Blowing The Lid Off" test.

??? Explain.

Edit: Never mind. Name of the article earlier that had the strong critique of Snell.

Beer Baron wrote: Unfortunately the local guys have basically nothing in stock.

At the very least, the local guys and even walmart have some helmets that you can plunk on your head to get some fitment notions. Take written notes! Who's helmet, where it was tight, what the sizes were like. That lets you get some idea of your head shape and size for the various brands you try on. This will help you to figure out what helmets will likely fit your particular melon. Webbikeworld has good information on the shapes and fitment of helmets and can help you better estimate if a particular brand/model will fit you or not.

One of the real spoilers is finally finding the helmet that really fits you. Makes all those others that were ok, seem so not ok now. That helmet for me is the Shoei Neotec. A far more expensive, less vented helmet that I want anything to do with. But it's also a helmet that I could probably wear all day, every day, without any pain. It just fits. I wouldn't have known that if I didn't go to shops and try helmets on.

I like this diagram to leer people to full face helmets. Notice the percentages on the chin area?

OK, so what are the drawings supposed to be indicating?

percentages of impacts

Not disputing the numbers, just no idea where they came from. I couldn't find anything on the web page referencing the graphic.

Don't disagree in the slightest that full face is better when slamming your head into things. Can a full face sometimes create situations that make that more likely? I think it can, sometimes.

Reduction in the range of vision is the biggie. They all cut out downward vision, so you won't see that squirrel shoot under your tires, or that rock that just came rolling into the road. Some full faced helmets are remarkably restrictive with side vision. Bell has some for example that are incredible for what you cannot see while wearing them. That webbikereview page has some excellent comments on the field of vision for each of the helmets they review.

Sound can come into play as well. To the horror of many, I'm prone to wearing my half helmet in the city so I can better hear traffic cues. Many years ago I participated in some MSF studies as a guinea pig where I was to follow audible instructions while riding wearing different helmets. The difference was not subtle. Many times, being able to hear an audible cue has helped me greatly to avoid a bad situation. The reving of an engine, bark of a tire, growl of a dog, etc.

Oh, I guess I should toss out the concern about neck snapping from the chin bar being grabbed, violently rotating the head. This was a big concern about 20 years ago. Think it was New Zealand that had a bunch of studies on it back then. Haven't seen anything more in many years though.

I'll agree with posters above it is very important to test fit with helmets. I have tried a few Bells, and they have all fit about the same, but my current Helmet is a Shoei TZ-R, which I tried after trying on a Shoei RF-1000. The RF did not fit my head shape very well, but the TZ-R was fine. I suspect this is a bigger issue with full face helmets than 3/4 helmets, but it sounds like you are looking for a full face model.

Web Bike World does a decent job of classifying internal helmet shapes in their reviews, if you can't try on a model you think you may want to buy: http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcycle-helmets/motorcycle-helmets.htm

foxtrapper wrote:

Reduction in the range of vision is the biggie. They all cut out downward vision, so you won't see that squirrel shoot under your tires,

Why are you looking down at your tires? It's too late to do anything and you can miss whats ahead of you.

Sound can come into play as well. To the horror of many, I'm prone to wearing my half helmet in the city so I can better hear traffic cues. Many years ago I participated in some MSF studies as a guinea pig where I was to follow audible instructions while riding wearing different helmets. The difference was not subtle. Many times, being able to hear an audible cue has helped me greatly to avoid a bad situation. The reving of an engine, bark of a tire, growl of a dog, etc.

Difference of opinion here... I feel the helmet clears out the wind noise and I can hear traffic more clearly

Oh, I guess I should toss out the concern about neck snapping from the chin bar being grabbed, violently rotating the head.

Vs grinding off your chin?

Not trying to be an ass...just my view points. Yes, I've been down hitting my helmet on the chin bar. I still have it, all gouged up. (no,I don't use it anymore)