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NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/28/20 12:30 p.m.

Perhaps the most interesting examples of "flying" air pumps were the Denver & Rio Grande Western K-28 narrow gauge Mikados. The air pumps are mounted to the fireman's side and the smokebox door is on the engineer's side of the engine. One of the few cases of an asymmetrically located smokebox that I can think of.

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/29/20 11:08 a.m.

Virginian also played around with electric locomotives. In 1922, at the cost of $15 million and over a 3 year construction period, they electrified 134 miles of track. It was the longest stretch of continuous mountain electrification and used an 11,000v alternating current catenary system powered by Virginian's own powerplant at Narrows, VA. Virginian ran through pretty rugged territory and electric locomotives were immensely powerful, and since they had access to bituminous coal fields, they had a steady source of cheap fuel for power.

The original locomotives were Alco-Westinghouse 1-D-1 configuration boxcabs. They were referred to as either an EL-1A, and EL-2A or an EL-3A, with the number referring to the amount of units in the set, and made 2000hp each and used the jackshaft method of power transmission . What looks like a lead drive wheel does not actually contact the rails and is the end of the motor, with a connecting rod hooking it to the 2 drive wheels. An EL-3A weighed over 1.2 million pounds, generated 230,000lbs of tractive effort and was over 152 feet in length, making them powerful but also abusive on the track infrastructure.

In '48, to supplement the aging boxcabs, Virginian approached GE for new units, and GE responded with huge B-B-B-B+B-B-B-B semi-permanently paired streamlined cab units that used recently developed AC rectifier technology to take full advantage of AC power. A single pair of EL-2Bs made was 150ft in length, weighed 1 million pounds and generated 6,800hp and 260,000lbs of tractive effort but, with more feet on the ground and no side rods making hammer blow impacts on the track, were much easier on the roadbed. Virginian purchased 4 two-unit sets.

In 1955, Virginian again returned to GE for more electric locomotives. This time they purchased 12 of a road switcher style electric locomotive of a C-C wheel configuration, which they called an EL-C. These were the first electric locomotives to succesfully utilize ignitron arc rectifier technology. They generated 3300hp and made 96,000lbs of tractive effort, while weighing 158 tons. Their arrival led to retirement of all of the old Westinghouse boxcabs. The EL-C was a catalog offering by GE, but with few railroads running electric freight operations, no other customers ever appeared.

The Virginian electrified line met its end in '59 though. After years of trying to acquire the Virginian, Norfolk & Western finally received approval from the ICC to purchase the Virginian. The small but massively profitable Virginian had been a thorn in the sides of the N&W and C&O for years and both had tried repeatedly (N&W even briefly operated the Virginian during WWI under the USRA's orders) and N&W finally won out. N&W almost immediately routed all westbound traffic, with the Virginian line only handling eastbound traffic. This reduction in traffic led to the immediate retirement and scrapping of the four EL-2Bs, leaving only the 12 new EL-Cs. After 3 years, the N&W decommisioned the electrification, finding it surplus to requirements.

The EL-Cs were the only VGN electrics to escape scrapping. The New Haven, under the disastrous leadership of Patrick McGinnis, had torn down a large portion of the catenary, despite financial consultants saying not to, and put all their big electric freight motors out to pasture in favor of dual-mode EMD FL9s. After it's '63 bankruptcy, the bankruptcy trustees realized that McGinnis had really had no clue what he was doing, and so they restrung catenary and purchased 11 EL-Cs (N&W had converted one to a yard slug) and all the spare parts for a firesale price, repainted them and reclassed them as an EF-4.

Then, in '68, they passed into Penn Central ownerships and were painted in the black with the "mating worms" logo and again reclassified as an E33.

In 1976, they again changed hands, becoming property of Conrail, who ran them until they ended electric operations in the early '80s

Two of the EL-Cs, the only Virginian electrics in existence, are preserved, one in Roanoke at the Virginia Museum of Transportation in Virginian livery, and the other at Illinois Railroad Museum in bedraggled Conrail Blue.

Appleseed
Appleseed MegaDork
10/29/20 1:38 p.m.

Funny, as Lionel made a Virginian rectifier, too. The 2329 Virginian Rectifier was Lionels only single rectifier-style electric locomotive produced during the postwar era. This engine is based upon General Electric's real-life EL-C locomotive built in 1956. It's an unusual looking electric locomotive and sales of this model were less than Lionel expected in 1958. It is believed this locomotive was only produced for a single year -- 1958 -- but cataloged in 1959 in an effort to sell excess inventory. This is a difficult item to locate.

 

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/29/20 2:45 p.m.
Appleseed said:

It's an unusual looking electric locomotive...

The similar E44s that GE built for PRR were nicknamed "Bricks" by the crews for a reason.

 

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/30/20 7:03 a.m.

Virginian also is, I believe, the only Class 1 railroad to have an entirely Fairbanks-Morse roster. 

They purchased 40 of the H-16-44 road switcher, which was a 1600hp 4-axle unit on par with the EMD GP7 or the Alco RS-3. This was the largest fleet of H-16-44s, with Milwaukee Road a close second, with 37.

They also purchased the largest fleet of H-24-66 "Train Masters", at a total of 25. The Virginian found the big 2400hp 6-axle units, which far outpowered anything else on the market at the time, useful for hauling coal trains through the mountain.

Recon1342
Recon1342 Dork
10/30/20 11:28 a.m.

I recently picked up an HO scale C-16 class 0-4-0. The prototype was a fascinating locomotive, with an enormous saddle tank and a tiny wheelbase. The C-16s were built in 1912 by Baldwin  for the Baltimore & Ohio's Pratt street line in Baltimore. They had 48" drivers, an 84" wheelbase, weighed 120,000 lbs, and had a tractive effort of 28,800 lbs. Designed for tight curves, they could negotiate an 82 degree bend. That's a 76 foot radius, or about 10" in HO  scale...

The most fascinating fact? Despite HO scale models being produced in the thousands, for every popular road name out there, the only owner was B&O, and they only built 4. 

 

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/30/20 1:59 p.m.

In reply to Recon1342 :

I'm assuming that was used for some sort of dock work. PRR had some big 0-4-0s, the A5s class, that they used in a similar capacity but they were tender engines, not tanks.

Some railroads also had some really bizarre home-built tank engines that they used for shoving locomotives around their shop facilities

4

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/30/20 2:51 p.m.

New York Central had some very unusual Shays. For starters, when you think of Shays, New York Central is not the first line that comes to mind. In 1923 though, New York Central purchased 5 Shays, originally numbered #1896-#1900 and then reunumbered to #7185-#7189 later, from Lima to use on the West Side Freight Line in New York City between 10th and 11th Avenue, presumably due to their ability to navigate sharp curve. An old city ordinance required the locomotives to be fully enclosed (particularly the gear drives) to not scare horses and so they ended up with a weird box body covering most of the engine. Visibility for the crew had to be nightmarish. They also had to have a horse and rider precede them down the street.

When most of the street trackage was removed and the West Side line electrified, around 1934, the Shays were replaced by box-cab diesels that could also run from third-rail electrification or on battery power. The Shays were transferred to western New York State for use on the Genesee Falls Railway, an industrial line in Rochester, and the Owasco River Railway, with trackage around Auburn — both NYC subsidiaries. Around 1942, the Marcellus & Otisco Lake also leased one of them, the #7185, from NYC and ran it for 2 years before returning it to the NYC with frame troubles, and then leased the #7187 for two more years. There is a photo of the #7187 with no body on it, no clue if it was removed by NYC, Genesee Falls or Owasco River, or if Marcellus & Otisco Lake removed it.

After 3 or 4 years of leasing, the #7187 was also sent back to NYC, and the M&OLRR purchased a Vulcan, and the #7187 was cut up in 47. I believe that would make #7187 the last survivor, as all the others were cut up around '44.

Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter)
Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
10/30/20 3:09 p.m.

I don't think I've posted this before, but the power outage the last couple days caused me to drag out this old battery powered railroad lamp that my uncle kept after he worked for L&N. I actually found an identical one about 10-years ago, so now I have a pair of them. 

slowbird
slowbird SuperDork
10/31/20 3:15 a.m.

Welp. I found another switcher I need to replicate someday, perhaps in a slightly newer state. This was an Alco S-4 owned by Ford Motor Company, I believe.

 

Actually, as cool as that is, I found some more recent ones that might be even better. Because orange.

Various EMD switchers. I find it kind of funny that Ford would buy anything from a manufacturer that was, at least for most of its life, a General Motors division.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/modelListRR.aspx?id=FRDX

slowbird
slowbird SuperDork
10/31/20 4:58 a.m.

Instead of sleeping, I looked for more history on Ford's usage of rail equipment, which I found on a site for Z gauge trains. River Rouge, where they build F150s and previously Mustangs and Model As.

https://www.zgauge.com/Z-scale-Full-Throttle-Black-Ford-33-Hoppers-p/ft2048.htm

Prototype Info:
The largest self-sufficient, integrated automobile factory in the world was created by Henry Ford in 1928 at Michigan's FORD RIVER ROUGE COMPLEX. Literally, in one end came raw materials and out the other left autos! There were over 100 miles of track in the facility alone, the hoppers painted yellow to signify that they had to run on FORD trackage and couldn't be interchanged. Meanwhile, the American FORD hopper fleet, painted in a customary black livery, was busy hauling coal, ores and all sorts of rocks, minerals and salts back to The Rouge! Eventually, FORD built other less intensive plants around the country to aid in building many different styles of automotive transportation, and the hopper gang was fractured to serve many parts of the USA.

There is some rolling stock out there, although not much. I found a few in N and O scale, that one in Z scale that's out of stock, and a couple in HO scale that seem to be very limited release customs done on Athearn cars. And I bought one. Oops.

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/31/20 7:17 a.m.

In reply to slowbird :

I've seen a photo of their Alco S3 in a red and black livery. Check out all the Lincolns and T-Birds in this photo too

They also had some very unique GE 132-ton switchers. The chromed curved hand rails, raised chrome lettering and numbering, grilles on the ends and headlight nacelles were done just for FoMoCo

Henry Ford went to GE himself and told them he wanted to buy some switchers but they had to do something about how ugly they were before he would buy them. So the GE staff went out and looked at the '38 Ford he had arrived in, made some sketches, and applied them to the 132-tonner

Recon1342
Recon1342 Dork
10/31/20 7:43 a.m.

Hey, Nick! Here's a good recording of UP 9009 I dug up. The triple cylinder arrangement results in an almost syncopated exhaust beat. She was recorded by Howard Fogg in 1954.

 

https://utahrails.net/up/up-4-12-2-sounds.php

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/31/20 8:05 a.m.

In reply to Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter) :

I have an old Dressel oil lamp, made in Arlington, NJ, stamped for the New York Central Systems that someone got me as a gift many years ago. I've never lit it though

kazoospec
kazoospec UberDork
10/31/20 9:14 a.m.

Just any FYI for the steam lovers.  It looks like Strasburg is running today.  Kazookid2 and I are currently watching them prep the engine on Virtual Railfan.

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/31/20 9:32 a.m.

In reply to kazoospec :

Lehigh Gorge/Reading & Northern is running #425 again next Friday, Saturday and Sunday. Part of me wants to make another trip to Jim Thorpe. Part of me knows that's mental

slowbird
slowbird SuperDork
10/31/20 12:29 p.m.

In reply to NickD :

That's a neat story and those switchers look rad.

Oh hey, apparently someone made those in HO scale at some point. I wonder if I could ever find one though.

https://www.michelle.lu/centercab.html

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
10/31/20 1:09 p.m.

In reply to slowbird :

There is one of the real switchers still in existence. After Ford retired them for newer Alcos and EMDs, they were sold off to Wellsville, Addison & Galeton, also known as The Wag. The Wag operated a section of B&O trackage, which had been isolated from the rest of the B&O system by a flood in '42. In '55, after Ford retired the GEs, WA&GRR purchased 2 of the FoMoCo 125-tonners and 5 of the 132-tonners, and retired them in stages through the '60s as they wore out, replacing them with trade-in EMD F-units that they purchased from GE.

By '73 the last of the Ford GEs was retired, with only the #1700 escaping the torch. the WA&G would get a large portion of its trackage wiped out by Hurricane Agnes in '72. then several customers on the line closed down and more flooding wiped out additional trackage. It filed for abandonement in 1975, was granted permission in '78 and ran its last train on March 13th of '79.

#1700 is restored in WA&G paint in North East, Pennsylvania at the Lake Shore Railroad Historical Society.

slowbird
slowbird SuperDork
10/31/20 2:10 p.m.

In reply to NickD :

Hey that museum is only a couple hours away from me. I'll have to go visit someday. Looks like they're closed right now due to COVID.

Also: Ford Probe sighting there in the last picture. Looks like a four-cylinder.

Gearheadotaku (Forum Supporter)
Gearheadotaku (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
11/1/20 1:01 p.m.
Appleseed said:

Funny, as Lionel made a Virginian rectifier, too. The 2329 Virginian Rectifier was Lionels only single rectifier-style electric locomotive produced during the postwar era. This engine is based upon General Electric's real-life EL-C locomotive built in 1956. It's an unusual looking electric locomotive and sales of this model were less than Lionel expected in 1958. It is believed this locomotive was only produced for a single year -- 1958 -- but cataloged in 1959 in an effort to sell excess inventory. This is a difficult item to locate.

 

Interesting. Did any model railroad ever use an overhead to supply power to the engine like the real thing?  Sure it sounds scary, but its the same voltage as the rails right?

Recon1342
Recon1342 Dork
11/1/20 3:13 p.m.

In reply to Gearheadotaku (Forum Supporter) :

I believe it is possible to run HO scale stuff that way, you just need to wire it correctly.

slowbird
slowbird SuperDork
11/1/20 5:20 p.m.

Yup, I have seen/heard of a few layouts like that. Europe has more electric trains so it might be more popular with modelers over there.

I wouldn't mind doing a small streetcar line like that.

Appleseed
Appleseed MegaDork
11/1/20 10:16 p.m.

Lionel's GG1 could receive power from overhead wires. It was designed with that option in mind by Lionel. Not sure about their other electrics, but they can be rewired for or overhead power. Check out Tom Layden's page on how he did just that.

Lionel 1990’s vintage Lionel 6-18304/5 Building an Operating Overhead Catenary System

914Driver
914Driver MegaDork
11/2/20 7:18 a.m.

Ambushed by Lawrence of Arabia 102 years ago.

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
11/2/20 7:52 a.m.

Norfolk & Western #1151 and #917, two of the "Lost Engines Of Roanoke", on March 11th, 2008

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