I'm sure it depends a lot on the state... but I know around here that speeding/traffic tickets handed out by the locals can often get turned into something lame like tail-light out. No point, but they still get some revenue. Saves your insurance.
I'm sure it depends a lot on the state... but I know around here that speeding/traffic tickets handed out by the locals can often get turned into something lame like tail-light out. No point, but they still get some revenue. Saves your insurance.
In Cali if you plead no contest they will usually reduce the fine by $50-$100 for a speeding ticket. I would think a ticket for passing a school bus might be worth talking to a lawyer about, it could cause problems with insurance in the future too.
Its more or less a racket, they don't give a damn, so long as they get their money, several cities with shiny happy person cops in the SE MI area (Hazel Park and Livonia seem to be the worst) have figured this out and streamlined it, now you always end up with a $150, 0 point, impeding traffic ticket on the spot, instead of a $130 3 point red light ticket, or a $90 2 point 10 over ticket. You can even pay online!
moparman76_69 wrote: Where did she come from that you don't have to wait for a school bus? Everywhere I've ever lived it's the same law.
Dunno why she didnt know the law. She has just lived in areas with a schedule such that she never passed a stopped bus before.
ncjay wrote: Justice system my A&&, it's another way of taxing people.
I openly refer to the local LEOs as auxiliary tax collectors.
In reply to Beer Baron; your friend needs to contact a lawyer. School bus passing violations are serious business, whatever the attorneys fees will be, will be a fraction of the potential insurance increases.
Supposedly the cop told her it was only one point. She pland to call the clerk and get a real story.
I honestly have only had to stop for school buses maybe five times in my life since I work 6pm- 6 am so I could see having a brain fart and not knowing what to do. I will be going to court since I got a speeding ticket two weeks ago. I know I screwed up I'm just hoping they'll let me pay my fine and not get any points on my license
Despite the fact that she was in the wrong, $855 is pretty steep. Legally speaking, she should pay the fine. Morally speaking, she didn't kill anyone.
I almost always fight tickets. It costs you a very small court cost and (in my experience) the judge tosses you a bone to shut you up.
The way I see it is a system of checks and balances. If no one challenged tickets, bogus tickets would be rampant. The fact that X% of tickets are challenged and overturned keeps law enforcers honest. 99% of them are honest anyway, but the system allows you to challenge it. If she is an honest person, her transgression has taught her a lesson, and it doesn't matter how much money she pays - the lesson has been learned. Challenging the fine doesn't reduce the learning experience, it simply reduces the financial burden.
Cops don't berkeley around when it comes to kids. $800 + bucks for going past the reds of a school bus? Not surprised. Can't imagine judges to too kindly on this either.
Lawyer up.
ice racer wrote: How did she get her drivers license and not know the school bus law ?
This was my first thought. With the safety of kids involved I would not expect a judge to be all that forgiving. I would be more concerned about her skills as a driver and does she actually know the rules of the road. She got very lucky. Hitting a child and god forbid killing a child will ruin your whole life. Her not knowing the school bus law would make me re think her qualifications to be driving. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse.
About the only thing that could get her some relief would be to agree to take some sort of drivers education course. upon completion of the course she would then have to submit a certificate of completion to the courts. At this point the courts may entertain some sort of reduction in her fine. If she did not know the school bus laws what other laws does she not know. I would consider having her take the course anyway. You may actually get an insurance break that would make it worth while and more importantly it would make her a better driver.
BTW the typical DE course here in MA will run you about $600-$800 depending on if you do the driving and ride along part or just the 30Hr classroom only.
I still think $855 is nuts. I could be doing triple-digit speeds on the highway and get a smaller fine than that.
dean1484 wrote:ice racer wrote: How did she get her drivers license and not know the school bus law ?This was my first thought. With the safety of kids involved I would not expect a judge to be all that forgiving. I would be more concerned about her skills as a driver and does she actually know the rules of the road. She got very lucky. Hitting a child and god forbid killing a child will ruin your whole life. Her not knowing the school bus law would make me re think her qualifications to be driving. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse. About the only thing that could get her some relief would be to agree to take some sort of drivers education course. upon completion of the course she would then have to submit a certificate of completion to the courts. At this point the courts may entertain some sort of reduction in her fine. If she did not know the school bus laws what other laws does she not know. I would consider having her take the course anyway. You may actually get an insurance break that would make it worth while and more importantly it would make her a better driver. BTW the typical DE course here in MA will run you about $600-$800 depending on if you do the driving and ride along part or just the 30Hr classroom only.
you would not believe how many drivers here in NC DON'T know the law when it comes to stopped school buses ...
2 lane rd = all stop
4 lane re w/o barrier between opposing traffic = all stop
4 lane w/ turn lane = stop only behind the bus
4 lane w/ physical barrier between lanes ( think jersey barrier) = stop only behind bus
but the amt. of jerkwads that think all stop all situations is amazing
SC is like NC where school buses are concerned. It can get confusing sometimes, such as those raised concrete curbs (not a Jersey barrier) make a road look like it's divided when it actually is not. A grass planted median means it's divided.
In reply to wbjones:
I'm pretty sure the law is similar everywhere.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_bus_traffic_stop_laws
high speed drifting Honda Accord (?????) - I lost interest after 2 minutes but there is a school bus on the road.....tanker truck......guns.......lots of sand.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=wIjzRKtR6IA&feature=fvwp
wbjones wrote: but the amt. of jerkwads that think all stop all situations is amazing
I'm going out on a limb here, but I would guess that they're just unwilling to take the chance of getting an $855 ticket and are playing it safe.
It costs $0.25 to call a lawyer's office. He/She will tell you what your chances are, but pretty much anything to do with school busses is bad juju.
I did it only once and a lawyer cost $200. He save that much on the fine, plus fewer points on my license. Higher points = higher insurance and the possibility of revocation.
Just call.
I keep getting tickets in East Atlanta - DeKalb County. I went to court to fight one, and will never ever! again.
You are stuck in a room with the absolute bottom of the barrel kind of people for hours and hours. Smelly, fighting, bumming, whining, drippy, cussin, butt ugly, etc.
I am so happy to pay any more tickets to avoid that level of hell.
dean1484 wrote:ice racer wrote: How did she get her drivers license and not know the school bus law ?This was my first thought. With the safety of kids involved I would not expect a judge to be all that forgiving. I would be more concerned about her skills as a driver and does she actually know the rules of the road. She got very lucky. Hitting a child and god forbid killing a child will ruin your whole life. Her not knowing the school bus law would make me re think her qualifications to be driving. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse.
To fully explain the situation:
She saw the bus in the other lane. Approached slowly. Stopped where the stop sign was sticking out. Looked around to be sure there were no children or anyone she would put in danger. She then proceeded again slowly.
She did not blow past a bus. She did stop. She just stopped at the wrong portion of the bus (near the back, not in front of it, because she saw no kids near the front), and she did not remain stopped for as long as she was supposed to. She treated the stop sign sticking out the side of a bus like a regular stop sign.
moparman76_69 wrote: In reply to wbjones: I'm pretty sure the law is similar everywhere. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_bus_traffic_stop_laws
no ... this same thread has come up on other forums ... some states require stop even if the highway is divided w/ barrier ... or so some of the responders say
and you should read the wiki link that you posted ... it even lists the states that are different 
I live in CA as well and these are my experiences.
My last 2 tickets (years ago, knock on wood) one was speeding and the other was unsafe turn- tires chirped in front of cop, not high rate of speed and no danger to anyone. Both I did Trial By Declaration, one I won outright because the officer tried to change the citation after the fact (prob after he realized I was fighting it) but he neglected to notify me properly and I made no mention of it in my defense which showed I had no knowledge of the revised charges. The second I lost in the written stage, requested a court trial and the officer didn't show up so I won there. No points and it was wiped off my record (one stuck until I sent the DMV the revised ruling.)
The process was this;
Call and ask for an extension, as long as you can get.
Then you go to court before the extension is up, ask for a Trial By Declaration at the clerks desk.
You pay the bond amount, they give you a form to fill out and send in. You get 30 days from that day to submit it.
Write in your side of events, don't give them any rope to hang you with, write "I plead not guilty"
Wait until the 30 days is almost up and send it in. Drop it off at the courthouse or send it certified for peace of mind.
The officer will have 30 days to send in his version of events. The judge will rule and you will get a verdict in the mail. If found not guilty, you get your money back via check a couple weeks later. If you're found guilty, you can request "Trial de novo" which is a new trial in the court. This is probably the only time in our justice system where if you don't like the outcome of a trial you can request a new one. Anyway, by this time it's been many months out and the officer has to show up and you can try your luck there. You are hoping the officer doesn't show up or has forgotten the specifics of the case or for the traffic court gods to be smiling on you that day. You can still ask for traffic school after all this if you are found guilty again.
My mom got a ticket last year, and this is what I had her do as well. She was in traffic and there was a very poorly marked closed highway junction, she followed an unmarked pickup truck and so did 5 other cars into the beginning of the closed section, she finally saw a small sign indicating the road was closed so she stopped, where a CHP was waiting and he gave all of them tickets except the truck, which was apparently part of the construction crew. Ticket was $400 something. She won her case in the written part and the check was mailed to her a few weeks later.
There's a website set up for this that I used the first time and there was a $25 fee I think, he walks you through it and even gives you templates. Well worth it. I can provide the link but I don't want to watercraft up the thread.
Sorry for the wall of text, hope it helps.
I can't begin to tell you how many tickets i've gotten out of going to court. I think my standing record is 6 in one session- and truthfully it was because I was in a courtroom full of morons trying to plead out of simple possessions and other crap, all while sounding like they were still high. Generally, the more intelligent you present yourself as while still maintaining an air of humility, the better it works for you. Honestly, and ESPECIALLY if this is her first offense, go to court for it. You might pay a couple bones on court costs and perhaps a fine, but it won't be the 900$ they're trying to bend her over for and the insane increase in insurance costs. Judges are people too, and they like people that are nice to them. Same as cops. I get out of nearly as many tickets on the side of the road as I do in court. Hell, I got out of 3 the other night. Right in front of my wifes work. As I was pulling in to pick her up. She works in a group home. Her residents got a show.
Update:
She called the clerk for more information. Clerk confirmed it is only a 1-point citation and was also shocked at how high the fine was. She plans to go to court. Fortunately it is at the local court, and not the county one.
don't know what the fine is here, but the points for passing a stopped school bus are the highest they give ... 5
What msdsm said. Been to court in my county a bunch of times. Only guy in the room without a law degree who wears a tie and speaks like he has more than a 3rd grade education. It goes a long way.
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