iceracer wrote: That's my two cents.
You should probably lower your price.
iceracer wrote: That's my two cents.
You should probably lower your price.
If you really want to see what the media and people of the day thought of Lincoln and his politics, look at the political cartoons of the day. They were down right nasty in the way they portrayed Lincoln.
The sad thing is over the years, the Confederate flag has taken on a meaning that is entwined with slavery and the oppression of the black man.
In reality, the struggle was more about the preservation of their freedom and a way of life not much different than the independence of the US from the British and the Texans from the Mexicans. You don't see a stigma with either of those flags.
Yep who called in on the front page
http://www.wmal.com/2015/06/24/listen/
listen at what is said starting about the 1 minute mark if you don't want to listen to the whole thing.
Who knew he was still with us.
bmw88rider wrote: The sad thing is over the years, the Confederate flag has taken on a meaning that is entwined with slavery and the oppression of the black man. In reality, the struggle was more about the preservation of their freedom and a way of life not much different than the independence of the US from the British and the Texans from the Mexicans. You don't see a stigma with either of those flags.
Yeah, the preservation of their freedom to keep slaves and a way of life where they kept slaves. That's all it was really about.
See also: my post on page 3 on this topic.
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/off-topic-discussion/what-the-confederate-flag-means-to-me/103044/page3/
And Curmudgeon's post on page 6 on this topic.
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/off-topic-discussion/what-the-confederate-flag-means-to-me/103044/page6/
It looks like private companies are going to effectively do for the confederate flag in the US what the German government did for Nazi symobls in Germany (France has similar laws BTW). Apple has just pulled all apps with Confederate flags in them from the app store, including Civil War games:
http://www.engadget.com/2015/06/25/apple-yanks-games-with-confederate-flags-from-the-app-store/
For the record I see nothing offensive whatsoever about having Confederate flag in a civil war game. First it's a game, second it's historically accurate to have them there. A zillion WW2 games have flown off the shelves full of swastikas and those weren't offensive either.
In reply to GameboyRMH:
What about Besiege with the rolling concentration camp? 
GameboyRMH wrote: It looks like private companies are going to effectively do for the confederate flag in the US what the German government did for Nazi symobls in Germany (France has similar laws BTW). Apple has just pulled all apps with Confederate flags in them from the app store, including Civil War games:
First off I seriously doubt this will "stick" eventually people will find the next demon to slay and they will forget all about this garbage. When that happens you will start seeing novelty items, the General Lee and yes even flags available again. Even now it is only the big stores that are afraid of getting bad press in the current E36 M3 storm that are pulling these items. Plenty of other places are still selling them and for many of them business is BOOMING. Heck you can get all sorts of Rebel Flag merchandise (and General Lee) from Cooter's Place online. Which I find stupid that people are attacking the Dukes of Hazard franchise 30 years after the fact, so in my opinion good on them for just keeping on doing what they do.
The idea of pulling games where the flag is being shown in historical accuracy is mind numbingly stupid and the perfect example of political correctness gone to far. What next we aren't going to have history books on the shelves because it might have a picture of a "losing flag" that someone somewhere finds offensive?
People are losing their ever loving minds. We have much larger problems that we should be dealing with instead we keep finding little piddly crap to argue and fight over that really doesn't matter.
rebelgtp wrote: We have much larger problems that we should be dealing with instead we keep finding little piddly crap to argue and fight over that really doesn't matter.
This surprises you... 
nothing real ever happens because "they" would rather you focus your attention on the show, instead of the man/men behind the curtain.
In reply to oldeskewltoy:
Hear, Hear.
In reply to rebelgtp:
Well. I think the problem is that there are issues that really do matter (prejudice/hatred/etc) but the way to fight that stuff isn't to create a shallow and short-lived media fad based on an isolated incident.
Yet, that's what happens cause we as a society have no attention span and the media and politicians just play to that so they can get paid.
Crap. Next thing we know houses won't catch fire and the firefighters will spend their time burning books. Apparently Ray Bradbury was a frickin prophet.
I guess I'm feeling extra-cynical today.
In reply to BlueInGreen44:
Actually, the way to have brought it up properly was not immediately after a tragedy........they are just using those senselessly slain for their own gain/agenda. Its actually sickening.
oldeskewltoy wrote:rebelgtp wrote: We have much larger problems that we should be dealing with instead we keep finding little piddly crap to argue and fight over that really doesn't matter.This surprises you...
Nope does not surprise me me at all really. Which is sad in some ways. Really actually does bother me I spent so many years thinking my dad was paranoid and like but now I see how right he was about many things. Except that the government implanted cybernetics in his arm.
In reply to yamaha:
Agree and double-agree.
rebelgtp wrote: People are losing their ever loving minds. We have much larger problems that we should be dealing with instead we keep finding little piddly crap to argue and fight over that really doesn't matter.
Yeah so whatever happened with that TPA thing again?
Oh yeah....
http://www.naturalnews.com/050198_Trade_Promotion_Authority_Trans-Pacific_Partnership_Congress.html
Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:iceracer wrote: That's my two cents.You should probably lower your price.
Too expensive for you ?
something something racist terrorist traitor flag something something south lost something
In response to GsmeboyRHM:
Don't take it the wrong way. Yes, I know slavery was one of the key points around the civil war. No, I don't think for an instance that slavery is right or ethical thing.
It was also no help that Buchanan was a weak president and really pissed off a lot of people from both sides with such fun choices as openly supporting the dred scott decision in his ingratiation speech and engaging in the morman wars. Oh and then there was his scheme to try and annex Cuba and make it a slave state.
Either way, it was 150 years ago now. It's very important to remember the past and the lessons that it teaches you. Time to move on and heal as a nation and quit hiding behind a flag as an excuse. There are still a ton of problems out there that no one is really working to solve.
which flag are we talking about?
the stars and bars
the 2nd national flag
the 3rd national flag (yes.. they had three)
the bonnie blue flag?
The battle flag
the naval jack?
In reply to moparman76_69:
Yep mentioned that to a couple people and they had no freaking clue.
yamaha wrote: In reply to BlueInGreen44: Actually, the way to have brought it up properly was not immediately after a tragedy........they are just using those senselessly slain for their own gain/agenda. Its actually sickening.
The disdain for the Confederate flag started long ago. It has been associated with racism for the last 60+ years. This isn't a kick-off for an agenda, it was a tipping point.
In reply to Cone_Junkie:
No, its not a tipping point, people have national attention, so they're going to use it. This seems to happen following every tragedy lately. Its unethical at best, and plain heinous at worst.
oldeskewltoy wrote:rebelgtp wrote: We have much larger problems that we should be dealing with instead we keep finding little piddly crap to argue and fight over that really doesn't matter.This surprises you...
Don't forget very few want to take on real issues that would help the country as it would be difficult and they would have to knowledgeable about the subject
Cone_Junkie wrote:yamaha wrote: In reply to BlueInGreen44: Actually, the way to have brought it up properly was not immediately after a tragedy........they are just using those senselessly slain for their own gain/agenda. Its actually sickening.The disdain for the Confederate flag started long ago. It has been associated with racism for the last 60+ years. This isn't a kick-off for an agenda, it was a tipping point.
A tipping point... Maybe. Until it fades from the news and they find something else to generate web traffic and viewing ratings. All the while the root problems keep on problem-ing while the not directly affected majority go about living their blissfully ignorant lives.
I'm speaking about the pattern I've seen with many similar issues. Like that religious freedom bill bruhaha in Indiana. That blew up the internet for what, a week? Maybe this one will be different.
On topic: Here in Michigan my observance has been that the flag is ( up here in Yankee land) embraced by high school kids with pickup trucks who didn't pay attention in history class and want to identify with the "country" culture. Whatever that means.
And racist folk. Like the fine gents who decided to cruise by the summer camp full of inner city kids yelling hate speech, their pickup flying that flag.
Alright so for all of those that are all cheering about these companies saying they won't carry anything with the confederate flag so they don't "offend" anyone, how do you feel about the fact these same companies selling items with swastikas and the soviet hammer and sickle on them? Where is the outrage about those items?
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