Formula 1-2021 Season

I don't follow F1 but saw that Bottas had a DNF because his pit crew couldn't remove his wheel. 

Can somebody explain (in GRM speak) what happened with the wheel? Seems like a weird failure for a sport with that much money involved.

In reply to CrustyRedXpress :

Sounds like it was a cross threaded wheel nut that stripped the threads on the hub. We'll probably learn more later but that was the report from Mercedes during the race. 

Thin, large diameter nuts are pretty easy to cross thread. Definitely a whoopsie, especially since that wheel wasn't put on during a time-sensitive stop but was installed in the garage. 

What a boring race.

6 different teams in the top 7.  Only Williams and Haas not scoring points.

I wonder if this is the point of the season where the talking heads will say the championship shifted? 

Or will it be a footnote, in another season of Red Bull broken parts and iffy racecraft?

Baku could be another good one for Max &Co.

The talking heads already made that claim before the race was over. Gotta manufacture the drama!

Streetwiseguy said:

I wonder if this is the point of the season where the talking heads will say the championship shifted?

I mean, if Max winds up holding the championship lead until the end of the season then yes, by definition it will be.  Monaco is unique though, so I would hesitate to predict anything based on these results.

Baku... 3 runnings so far and if not for a puncture in 2018 and a loose headrest in 2017 they would probably have all been Mercedes 1-2 finishes.

Streetwiseguy said:

I wonder if this is the point of the season where the talking heads will say the championship shifted? 

Or will it be a footnote, in another season of Red Bull broken parts and iffy racecraft?

Baku could be another good one for Max &Co.

While it turned out not to matter because of Bottas' problem, Max did a great job managing the race- he made sure that Bottas would come out behind Perez no matter what if he pitted.  

The fact that Lewis could not undercut Gasley pretty much illustrated his weekend- he could not get the tires to switch on.  If he could, the undercut was a real possibility, and keeping Vettel behind would have been pretty likely.  So while Lewis really bitched about his team's plan, I think they thought he would be able to switch on the tires- it was as much his fault as it was the team.  Or the car's fault for having tire problems.  Maybe because of that, they should have overcut....  

Monaco is a real Red Bull track, and they earned it today.

Nobody was really pushing out there- no yellows at all.

And before anyone bails on Mercedes, the press should remind themselves how Merc finished the season after that pathetic wet German GP.

codrus (Forum Supporter) said:

Streetwiseguy said:

I wonder if this is the point of the season where the talking heads will say the championship shifted?

I mean, if Max winds up holding the championship lead until the end of the season then yes, by definition it will be.  Monaco is unique though, so I would hesitate to predict anything based on these results.

 

It was less a "Will the talking heads notice", and more of a "I wonder whether Max can continue to beat Lewis?" question.

Imagine that Toto has fear stricken into everyone at Mercedes after this weekend. Even after a disaster of a weekend Hamilton still scores points, championship is still in the bag for him.  I imagine next race will be a 1-2 or 1-3 finish. Mercedes always seems to finish strong after the break, while competitors have a full on meltdown. 

In reply to trigun7469 :

Having "seen" Wolfe's management style, I seriously doubt there's fear.  Desire to do it right, and be creative to find the solutions and not throw out blame is more likely.  They will figure out the issue, address it, and fix it.  And if something was missed, the person (or people) who missed it will not be chastised or fired.

IMHO, that's what's really separated Mercedes from the rest of the field over the hybrid generation.  

Now I don't feel like a total hack when I have to break out the shotgun, err...dremel to fix stuff.. Tire still on Bottas Mercedes

EDIT: A couple of outlets have posted a pic of the ruined wheel nut so i'll hotlink for posterity

In reply to 06HHR (Forum Supporter) :

I knew that was going to be the problem as soon as they started trotting out absurd theoretical situations on the air.  

There was a clear disconnect from reality from guys who should know better.

alfadriver said:

In reply to trigun7469 :

Having "seen" Wolfe's management style, I seriously doubt there's fear.  Desire to do it right, and be creative to find the solutions and not throw out blame is more likely.  They will figure out the issue, address it, and fix it.  And if something was missed, the person (or people) who missed it will not be chastised or fired.

IMHO, that's what's really separated Mercedes from the rest of the field over the hybrid generation.  

Exactly! I think this is why I have such a strong feeling that MB and Lewis Hamilton will win this year. They continue to maintain a team dynamic that is not hampered by finger pointing. It will work on the wheel nut design and have it in place at Baku or France. At least that used to be the timing they could afford. With the budget cap they may have to adjust the expedited design and machining time out to save costs. But they will sit down fix it and be back. I will say they did finally get a competitive pit stop done for Hamilton. RB was gaining a second per pit stop on MB every race up to Monaco. 

I think that is partly why Ferrari has failed and why HAAS can't get going is they adopted the wrong management style. Bonnoto at Ferrari is a fresh start of teamwork that doesn't have to be fire and flash to be effective. McLaren has a slightly different tone but still very much a teamwork oriented rather than point the finger mentality.  

Streetwiseguy said:

In reply to 06HHR (Forum Supporter) :

I knew that was going to be the problem as soon as they started trotting out absurd theoretical situations on the air.  

There was a clear disconnect from reality from guys who should know better.

I understand that the media commentators are paid to "create" excitement but they choose to do so by fabricating stories with wild theories and lots of "we" statements. 

WE have been waiting for this titanic battle between Lewis and Max. (Well no I have not even yet considered Max to be at the same level at Lewis and haven't seen anything titanic)

How will MB come back from this crushing blow? (Well MB won three races so far and probably shouldn't have won two of them) 

Max has mounted an incredible comeback to take his first championship lead! (Max was down less than a race win worth of points so chill. Yes congrats on leading the championship for the first time.)

I have a question about the MCL-35. What is so different? I know some cars are hard to dive and some seem easier. I've also seen people take a little time to come up to speed but I am surprised by Danny struggling so much. The thing that really made me think was he said in an interview last week that Sainz texted him something about how weird the car is to drive. I watch a lot but I have never driven anything more than autocross so I have a lot of learning to do but this one has me head scratching. 

In reply to New York Nick :

It's is interesting that cars that are so "spec" with super tight rules, and are conceptually the same (high rake) can be that different.  Perez had some issues, too- not nearly like Daniel, but it's been a challenge.  

In reply to Advan046 :

Seeing Ferrari's progress from last to this year, I'm actually thinking Bonnoto is doing a pretty darned good job.  They've made the biggest advancements is a year that should have been stagnant.  And it's not just the power, as evidenced by the speed at Monaco.  Maybe they will do really good on tight tracks this year- but the improvement is pretty darned clear.

Steiner, on the other hand...  Should have been fired after the Poor Energy debacle.  He seems to have no real concept of fixing problems as a manager- the team pattern has always been a strong start, and then a fade.  Problems can't be solved, and then carry over into more years.  And he can't find decent funding.  If they get sold to Mazapan, I do hope, though, he stays on, LOL.

alfadriver said:

In reply to trigun7469 :

Having "seen" Wolfe's management style, I seriously doubt there's fear.  Desire to do it right, and be creative to find the solutions and not throw out blame is more likely.  They will figure out the issue, address it, and fix it.  And if something was missed, the person (or people) who missed it will not be chastised or fired.

IMHO, that's what's really separated Mercedes from the rest of the field over the hybrid generation.  

His "Bottas didn't stop in the right spot" comment seems like he's totally willing to throw Bottas under the bus on this one.  The other 3 tires got off and back on fine, did only 1 wheel stop in the wrong spot?

In reply to NorseDave :

It's a factual statement.  Caused the wheel guy to put the gun on a little crooked.  It's not as if they are going to blame Valteri or the gun guy- they will put measures in place to prevent that from happening again.  Speeding up the stops has some consequences, and they need to take care of all of them.

In reply to alfadriver :

I understand Perez struggling to adapt a little and he has seemed to pick it up. Max struggled with that car and so did Alvin so it kind of made sense to me. It seemed like it went from turning to out from under you in a hurry. The MCL35 never seems to be soon happy, he just can't drive it fast ??? 

I know these cars are heavily regulated but they all seem very different. Not just team to team but race to race. I find it amazing how many details of the cars change every race. The Merc lug nut debacle last week sent me down a lug nut rabbit hole. Every team custom designs and makes their own lug nuts! 

NorseDave said:

alfadriver said:

In reply to trigun7469 :

Having "seen" Wolfe's management style, I seriously doubt there's fear.  Desire to do it right, and be creative to find the solutions and not throw out blame is more likely.  They will figure out the issue, address it, and fix it.  And if something was missed, the person (or people) who missed it will not be chastised or fired.

IMHO, that's what's really separated Mercedes from the rest of the field over the hybrid generation.  

His "Bottas didn't stop in the right spot" comment seems like he's totally willing to throw Bottas under the bus on this one.  The other 3 tires got off and back on fine, did only 1 wheel stop in the wrong spot?

Toto didn't throw him under the bus, he mentioned that Valteri stopped a bit off his ideal location.  The gasping, grasping headline douches implied it.

It was a combination of factors that created a one in a thousand failure.  One of those factors was the gun not going on straight, because the car, driven by Valteri,  was an inch or two out of place.  And the tire guy was a bit out of place. And the nut was slightly weak.  And the socket was a bit sharp.  And a bunch of other stuff.

No bus.  No throwing.

In reply to Streetwiseguy :

All that reminds me how much effort many of the F1 "news" outlets are trying to make the Verstappen- Hamilton thing far, far far more than it is.  I think next time I see one of those, I will not only skip it, I will put a thumbs down.  Just irritating that they want to make that kind of drama.

In reply to alfadriver :

That drama is all that Drive to Survive is and it has had a big benefit for Liberty in that it has brought a lot more eyes to the sport. 

I agree though, I don't watch it for the drama outside of the cars on track.

Streetwiseguy said:

NorseDave said:

alfadriver said:

In reply to trigun7469 :

Having "seen" Wolfe's management style, I seriously doubt there's fear.  Desire to do it right, and be creative to find the solutions and not throw out blame is more likely.  They will figure out the issue, address it, and fix it.  And if something was missed, the person (or people) who missed it will not be chastised or fired.

IMHO, that's what's really separated Mercedes from the rest of the field over the hybrid generation.  

His "Bottas didn't stop in the right spot" comment seems like he's totally willing to throw Bottas under the bus on this one.  The other 3 tires got off and back on fine, did only 1 wheel stop in the wrong spot?

Toto didn't throw him under the bus, he mentioned that Valteri stopped a bit off his ideal location.  The gasping, grasping headline douches implied it.

It was a combination of factors that created a one in a thousand failure.  One of those factors was the gun not going on straight, because the car, driven by Valteri,  was an inch or two out of place.  And the tire guy was a bit out of place. And the nut was slightly weak.  And the socket was a bit sharp.  And a bunch of other stuff.

No bus.  No throwing.

 

If you look at the overhead it's clear that if Bottas missed his mark if was by the tiniest of margin. A system that requires more precision than Bottas provided and has as many disconnected part as an F1 pit stop is a poorly designed system. 
It's not as if Merc require this level of precision because they are the pinnacle of pit stops. Max was significantly farther off the mark and RB still did a 1.82s stop. I think Toto was off base with placing any of this on VB.

Valtteri's nut jam got off

https://www.yahoo.com/autos/five-days-later-jammed-wheel-171000638.html