Indy "Nub" Guy said:In reply to garaithon :
Hey, with an offer like that, how can I say no? I'll even deliver the harness to you. I need to get down your way and check out your new garage set up.
How's the "Whale" coming along? I haven't seen an update lately.
I have made quite a bit of progress! Just haven't taken the time to update. Let's just say I have your old manifolds installed!
In reply to garaithon :
Yes !
It's cold here in Indiana at the moment, so to make garage time this weekend tolerable, I bought this guy:
With the LS power is going to come the need for wider rubber eventually, so I went ahead and cut out these bump stops intended for the IRS TR4A, but I've got the solid axle, so they're unnecessary
Posting some pics of the transmission with dimensions for reference on throw-out bearings etc.
Those heaters are good but remember absolutely no brake cleaner is to be used with them on in the garage.
Some of the crew came out to help with re-installing the engine:
The engine JUST WOULD NOT GOT IN !
Turns out I welded the mounts rearward about an inch and a half from the mock-up months ago.
With the engine touching the "fire wall" remnants you can see below how far off the mounts were:
So engine back out, mark a line and get the cuttin' tools back out:
After removing that bit, the engine went in ok and looks like the only other surgery needed is to clear this part of the header:
Sawzall and metal hot glue gun solves all.
I'm still trying to work out the fuel system. Not sure why this is troubling me so much. (thinks to self: "maybe it's because I don't want to catch myself on fire or blow things up")
While in there yesterday, I discovered the tank does indeed have two openings on the bottom of the tank. One is the fuel line out, and the other had a plug in it:
The line hanging down in the picture above is right on the other side of the trunk floor. I sketched an approximate line in the pic below to show its relative location:
I pulled the plug out and here's what it looks like:
Next post let's discuss the fuel plan.
So, Here's the current plan:
Mount this surge tank right there in the trunk area. (Surge tank is small, about 4"x 4" x 8" Long)
Here's the depth of the trunk area (I've got about 7 inches of depth, surge should mount just fine with the long dimension horizontal)
Because this is below the fuel tank, here's the plan:
Does this make sense ?
Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:Those heaters are good but remember absolutely no brake cleaner is to be used with them on in the garage.
The radiant heaters are not so bad. But man you do not want to use brake clean with a forced air open-flame heater.
If you're going to be doing a lot of engine r/ring look at an engine leveler. I got one through Home Depot for $40.
can't wait to see the motor in its home
In reply to Indy "Nub" Guy :
I wouldn't out a filter between tank and surge tank if it's only gravity fed. Might cause a restriction. If the efi pump has a sock, that should suffice. Also if it's gravity fed, you may need a vent hose from surge tank to the top of the main tank.
If it were me, for a Challenge car, I would skip the surge tank altogether and figure out how to adapt an efi pump and sender to your original tank, so you can save the surge tank and all those fittings from the budget. Most newer cars have filter, regulator, pump, and sending unit all in one drop-in flange. But that requires welding a gas tank. Either way should work though.
You still need a return from surge to main tank, in addition to the return to surge from regulator.
Im also kinda impressed that you have that much room!
In reply to maschinenbau (I live here) :
I agree. I think adapting an in tank sending unit is the way to go. You can probably use a bolt in style sending unit and then hole saw and drill the holes needed to install it. Mildly safer than welding a fuel tank!
I think, if a surge tank is used, I would not use that as the destination for returned fuel if the rest of the fuel system is set up for a return. The fuel will be hotter for having been sent through the system and I think it would cool better if returned to the main tank instead of back to the surge where it is about to get pulled into the main fuel pump again.
It seems like having the main tank gravity filling the surge and then that feeds an inline frame-mounted pump should work well but grain of salt with everything I'm suggesting as I have not designed such systems. I wouldn't put a filter between the main tank and the surge; a filter after the pump seems wise.
Re-read through the whole thread again. I may have missed it, but I don't think I did. Did you make plans to tighten the frame up and prevent twisting?
Boxing the frame might help, potentially cheap as well
In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :
Fuel needs to be filtered before the high pressure pump to protect it.
jfryjfry (FS) said:If you're going to be doing a lot of engine r/ring look at an engine leveler. I got one through Home Depot for $40.
can't wait to see the motor in its home
I went ahead and ordered one off ebay, based on your advice. I should have done it sooner.
TurnerX19 said:In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :
Fuel needs to be filtered before the high pressure pump to protect it.
Eh, probably? Between the surge tank and the in-line pump then.
In reply to Dusterbd13-michael, maschinenbau, Garaithon, & pres589 (djronnebaum) :
I'm not going to cut up the stock tank, drill new holes in it or even add a return line. (not now at least, and hopefully never)
I went ahead and ordered that surge tank with the built in 044 Bosch type fuel pump. I'm going to try and gravity feed it with the factory tank to one of those ports, the top port will be a line for a vent to let air out, and the last one will be return from the 044 pump. If it doesn't work, I'll punt and try something else. This all has required too much mental gymnastics. I think for the initial start up It'll be just fine.
Mr_Asa said:Re-read through the whole thread again. I may have missed it, but I don't think I did. Did you make plans to tighten the frame up and prevent twisting?
Boxing the frame might help, potentially cheap as well
I'm going to weld some strength back into the center of the "X" (near the trans mount) that the previous owner cut out. I'll do that once the body comes back off. I also plan to add some drive shaft loop type protection in there as well.
pres589 (djronnebaum) said:TurnerX19 said:In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :
Fuel needs to be filtered before the high pressure pump to protect it.
Eh, probably? Between the surge tank and the in-line pump then.
Look up a few posts. That drain plug has a good bit of surface rust on it. I'd expect the rest of the tank is kinda crusty too. A fuel filter will go between the tank and the inlet to the surge tank, and then another filter after the pump before the fuel regulator.
My fear with that is the chance of vapor pressure building up in the filter when placed between the fuel tank and the surge tank. If the tank isn't clean then that should be dealt with (within reason) instead of just adding a filter and going. I'm thinking back to issues I had with a gravity fed motorcycle I owned and how I tried to band-aid the situation with a filter added between the carbs and the tank to catch rust from the tank. At times a vapor "bubble" would form in the filter and stop fuel flow. That setup you're describing sounds similar.
If I'm in the minority on this and others have direct experience with this exact setup then by all means go the route you're describing.
In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :
Noted about the vapor lock/bubble with a filter there.
This tank has sat empty and dry for the five years I've owned it. Who knows how long before that. To start off with I'm going to use a filter after the tank. After several tank fill ups have cycled thru to catch the rust, if I have the problem you describe, I'll pull the filter out.
Note: air cooled engine motorcycle tank/filter is right above giant heat source, accelerating vaporization. It should be cooler than that at the rear of the car.
This showed up Friday when I got home from work:
Sizing up the location:
Get out the death wheel and cut some metal:
Surge tank gets tuck in below the trunk level, but above the frame:
With that new hole in the trunk floor, it's officially time to learn how to weld sheet metal. So I grabbed the box of scraps I kept (from the surgery on the firewall) to practice a bit:
I tried the method NOHOME described in the Molvo thread: (this is literally the first sheet metal I've ever welded)
Here's the settings on the welder (0.030" diameter wire)
So I went ahead and welded this corner back on for more practice:
Ground out ok, so I guess I'll be ready to box this in and then move onto the fire wall:
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