Internet safety/ security help

Advan046 wrote:

SVreX wrote: And Cruella is posting primarily from a work computer, which makes it impossible to prove who was sitting there.

I find this odd as every workplace I have been in requires secure logins now. Even if to just track usage of software by x versus y group. Heck even the local diner lists the waitresses name on the receipt for tracking. I would think the company would see the holes in their internet security if someone can use them from inside their building to send data out without any tracking to the employee sending out the stuff.

As noted above, it's not a technical problem. It's a leadership/ racial/ political problem. They could certainly prove it if they wanted to.

If it was me, I'd have my lawyer serving warrants to the employer. But my daughter has a point- the employer could solve their problem pretty quickly by firing Cruella. That would anger her, and she would double-down on her efforts to harm my daughter. That won't actually solve anything.

WildScotsRacing wrote: I don't understand her employers not wanting to get involved in helping prove that it was her. I can assure you that if her employer has an in-house IT Department they absolutely will be able to prove that it was her sitting behind the keyboard at the time those threats were sent from their own computers. The question now becomes; since the purp has been positively identified, how far are you willing to go to ensure that the perp absolutely loses all taste for continuing this game? (read into that what you will)

Exactly.

Depending on the IT resources and security procedures at the employer, it may be possible to be more sure of who was at the keyboard. Craigslist could say the posting came from her employer's network. Her employer could say cdeville was the only user who accessed the craigslist posting page at that time and date. There might be automated emails in her corporate email box. Certain jobs (bank teller, cashier) may even have a security camera that could corroborate the posting. Sure, Cruella could say it wasn't her, but then she's probably still in trouble with her employer, who'll ask, "why did you let someone else use your account?"

Then again, I've worked in some places that are really lax, so there might also be nothing.

Edit: SVreX posted while I was typing, covering pretty much all of the above.

Advan046 wrote: I truly feel sorry for you. My daughter studied this topic for her criminal justice class and it seemed to come down to: - Methods to prevent cyber crime are extremely invasive into privacy of anyone on the net. - Methods to catch criminals after the fact either require extremely invasive internet warrants and/or extremely aggressive physical seizure of anything connected to the person of interest including tech of family, friends, work, local library, etc. Both aren't what the majority of Americans want (see the whole phone meta data collection "scandal"). It sounds more like a family problem than an internet one. The technology are just tools to try and focus attention on the family member initiating the negative vibes. But in the end I think you should spend time focusing on gathering knowledge of how to get the family resolution completed. More consultation of therapists to help those on your Daughter's side of things effectively move the other family members towards refocusing Cruella to other things. Most people aren't mentally unstable, so Cruella can't be happy spending all that time trying to hurt your daughter. Maybe she needs a platform or another way to communicate her griefs and have them resolved even if it is coming to terms to agree to disagree. Sometimes just avoiding a touchy topic is enough to repair family breaks. Just agree to never discuss it. Talk about the kids summer camp or Avengers movie x or only about food.

Yes, you have nailed the problem. The solution is harder.

Cruella is fenced in by her side of the family who is already entrenched in their racially motivated hatred. They will protect her to the death. They certainly won't encourage her to seek counseling of any sort, because they believe she is justified in her anger and hostility toward anyone racially different. They honestly believe she would do nothing wrong, and any problem must certainly be my daughter's fault. They couldn't care less if the family remains estranged forever.

The path Cruella is headed down will one day lead to her being institutionalized, imprisoned, or dead. Her family will continue to blame others.

SVreX wrote: And Cruella is posting primarily from a work computer, which makes it impossible to prove who was sitting there.

Huh I'm surprised she's still doing that, since she should know that we busted her on her office computer, and we know she's used a VPN account or proxy once since. Well it's good news that she's being careless.

I still think you should get the info from Cragislist, it might not be possible to link definitively to Cruella's identity, but it could be a good piece of circumstantial evidence that can be used in court, possibly to prove that she's violating the restraining order.

SVreX wrote: It's stalking, by a person with a disturbed mind.

QFT. For others in the thread, I have independently learned that this is not a case of weekend cyber-bullying, this is a potentially dangerous stalker who just happens to use the Internet.

In reply to SVreX:

Yes this sounds more and more like something for work on relationships to resolve the root cause.

Tech and security will just deal with the symptoms. Your daughter's openness on the internet is part of her goal in life. This harassment is part of the downside of things. She can max out her internet security controls and also her physical security as others have stated. But expect that it will always continue to happen. I like to think of it as the price of doing business. If you have a restaurant you can expect that at some point someone will walk out on the bill. You can try to build up a security presence to prevent that but as some point it is ridiculous like having a guard watching each table; gets expensive and takes away from the point of enjoying a restaurant business. Maybe someone for some reason tries to the smash the window once a month. You eventually end up with what? no windows? Not such a nice restaurant space anymore. There is a balance she needs to try and find with being ok with the harassment in order to enjoy her internet life. It isn't fair, but it is reality. Try to get to the root cause and resolve that.

In reply to SVreX:

I agree that this is actually a family problem rather than a cyber bullying event. The internet is simply a tool to that end for Cruella. So on that point has anyone actually put any serious effort in to simply finding out what started it all in Cruella`s mind? As in actually going directly to her and saying "so Cruella, what is it that set you off? What can we do for you?" And just make sure that you are able to record clearly every word of her response for later use against her if necessary.

In reply to GameboyRMH:

We will definitely use the CL info.

I am concerned, because this is a new level of stupid. CL users have developed various methods of communicating things like phone numbers that take advantage of CL's primitive software system.

So, for example... If I type(331) something that looks223 kinda weird, crazy CL users know I am communicating2241 a phone number. However, you can't search CL for that phone number, or any part of it (unless you also know the random words I attached to the parts of the number).

So, there is no way for my daughter (or anyone) to monitor CL for postings of her phone number. Cruella can write it in as many ways as she wants, and as many creeps as possible can find it and use it as they see fit. It's pretty limitless.

Seems like a remote stalker's paradise. It's pretty easy to get a small army of creepy people chasing after an innocent young girl if your only desire is to cause harm to that individual.

WildScotsRacing wrote: In reply to SVreX: I agree that this is actually a family problem rather than a cyber bullying event. The internet is simply a tool to that end for Cruella. So on that point has anyone actually put any serious effort in to simply finding out what started it all in Cruella`s mind? As in actually going directly to her and saying "so Cruella, what is it that set you off? What can we do for you?" And just make sure that you are able to record clearly every word of her response for later use against her if necessary.

Yes. She's been approached several times. Response is always the same- denial and blame.

Keep in mind... most of you guys are essentially sane. For the most part. Your suggestions assume a certain level of sanity on the part of the recipient.

I am not convinced we are dealing with a sane person.

SVreX wrote: Cruella is fenced in by her side of the family who is already entrenched in their racially motivated hatred. They will protect her to the death. They certainly won't encourage her to seek counseling of any sort, because they believe she is justified in her anger and hostility toward anyone racially different. They honestly believe she would do nothing wrong, and any problem must certainly be my daughter's fault. They couldn't care less if the family remains estranged forever.

I see. It is unfortunate that this family doesn't want to move towards helping Cruella see how to build enjoyment in her own life. Regardless of their views on race/politics there must be happier, more fun things for Cruella to do than relate in any way to your daughter.

Maybe I am missunderstanding the situation.... is it more that Cruella is a tool for the family en masse to target your daughter? If that is the case then wow. IDK.

SVreX wrote: So, there is no way for my daughter (or anyone) to monitor CL for postings of her phone number. Cruella can write it in as many ways as she wants, and as many creeps as possible can find it and use it as they see fit. It's pretty limitless. Seems like a remote stalker's paradise. It's pretty easy to get a small army of creepy people chasing after an innocent young girl if your only desire is to cause harm to that individual.

Actually there are ways to work around that, and I'm surprised spammers don't go through the effort...it's rather resource-intensive though as you have to scrape every potentially relevant Craigslist post and run a special search on it. But for a certain section of a certain area's Craigslist, it wouldn't be so bad...

Your daughter might have to consider keeping her phone number secret from now on, like a celebrity.

Is it possible to forward your daughter's phone to Cruella's? Get daughter a new phone, new number, and don't give it to anyone who is even remotely likely to give it out. I think it is truly sucky that cruella's employer is unwilling to get involved. So sorry that your daughter is having to go through this, but you have raised a very intelligent gal who can see the big picture. Cruella won't keep her down. Edit: I am honored, no one has ever called me "mostly sane". I think you may be being generous, but thank you.

SVreX wrote:

WildScotsRacing wrote: In reply to SVreX: I agree that this is actually a family problem rather than a cyber bullying event. The internet is simply a tool to that end for Cruella. So on that point has anyone actually put any serious effort in to simply finding out what started it all in Cruella`s mind? As in actually going directly to her and saying "so Cruella, what is it that set you off? What can we do for you?" And just make sure that you are able to record clearly every word of her response for later use against her if necessary.

Yes. She's been approached several times. Response is always the same- denial and blame.

Is there a surrogate that can bridge the divide? Uncle Arbitrator can focus on learning what Cruella wants, not focusing on stopping the attacks but focusing on what does Cruella want to be happy and ignore your daughter. Maybe eventually get to a place where she is focused elsewhere.

For instance, "why tear someone down instead of building something great?" If sooooo political why not feed that and get her to join up with an organization that supports her politics. Greenpeace, Rainbow Push Coalition, NAACP, Girl Scouts, etc. Maybe worth a shot for Uncle Arb to set up the met and greet.

In reply to Advan046:

No, thats not the way I am understanding it.

I think they are a family that has always viewed the world through a negative filter, that their own problems and the world's problems are caused by people of a particular race. They are proud of Cruella, and see her as smart and accomplished. They don't see her illness, and believe anyone who has a disagreement with her must be racist, and therefore biased against her (and them)

SVreX wrote: Keep in mind... most of you guys are essentially sane. For the most part. Your suggestions assume a certain level of sanity on the part of the recipient. I am not convinced we are dealing with a sane person.

You cannot deal w/ a sociopath rationally or fairly ftm. They may actually get off on the chase... like some sick form of excitement. I'd bet your daughter is not Cruella's first victim, any chance of identifying other victims if possible? and create allies against Cruella? OR, play her game back on her to the nth degree. Wage a broad and relenting war, fair or not.

Tighten the screws and force Cruella to berkeley up.

Advan046 wrote:

SVreX wrote:

WildScotsRacing wrote: In reply to SVreX: I agree that this is actually a family problem rather than a cyber bullying event. The internet is simply a tool to that end for Cruella. So on that point has anyone actually put any serious effort in to simply finding out what started it all in Cruella`s mind? As in actually going directly to her and saying "so Cruella, what is it that set you off? What can we do for you?" And just make sure that you are able to record clearly every word of her response for later use against her if necessary.

Yes. She's been approached several times. Response is always the same- denial and blame.

Is there a surrogate that can bridge the divide? Uncle Arbitrator can focus on learning what Cruella wants, not focusing on stopping the attacks but focusing on what does Cruella want to be happy and ignore your daughter. Maybe eventually get to a place where she is focused elsewhere. For instance, "why tear someone down instead of building something great?" If sooooo political why not feed that and get her to join up with an organization that supports her politics. Greenpeace, Rainbow Push Coalition, NAACP, Girl Scouts, etc. Maybe worth a shot for Uncle Arb to set up the met and greet.

Thats very good, and definitely the way I am pushing it. Unfortunately, there is not a single person in the family who can approach both sides positively.

EastCoastMojo wrote: Is it possible to forward your daughter's phone to Cruella's? Get daughter a new phone, new number, and don't give it to anyone who is even remotely likely to give it out. I think it is truly sucky that cruella's employer is unwilling to get involved. So sorry that your daughter is having to go through this, but you have raised a very intelligent gal who can see the big picture. Cruella won't keep her down. Edit: I am honored, no one has ever called me "mostly sane". I think you may be being generous, but thank you.

I was thinking something along these lines. Buy a new phone, don't tell anyone, keep the old one active, set it to auto reply with Cruella's name/address/phone as a forwarding address.

Does Cruella know your daughter's real address?

It may be safest if she simply disconnected anything she could from Cruella and walked away. Can't win wrestling a pig and all that, I know I missed some of the back story, but to what degree is your daughter willing to start over with address/phone/facebook etc?

fasted58 wrote:

SVreX wrote: Keep in mind... most of you guys are essentially sane. For the most part. Your suggestions assume a certain level of sanity on the part of the recipient. I am not convinced we are dealing with a sane person.

You cannot deal w/ a sociopath rationally or fairly ftm. They may actually get off on the chase... like some sick form of excitement. I'd bet your daughter is not Cruella's first victim, any chance of identifying other victims if possible? and create allies against Cruella? OR, play her game back on her to the nth degree. Wage a broad and relenting war, fair or not. Tighten the screws and force Cruella to berkeley up.

Definitely my thinking. Not sure if my daughter is up for it- plays too close to the illegal and/or unethical edges.

Like I said, she's a better person than me.

I just checked, apparently moving is going to be a requirement for that to work.

In reply to fasted58:

Good points. SVReX, it seems very likely that your daughter is not Cruella's first victim of this. If that is the case, all your daughter needs to do is stop responding entirely and behave as if it never happened and is not happening. Cruella will become bored with your daughter's lack of response and move on to her next victim.

Perhaps our resident hacker can gain access to her rarely-properly-secured webcam to prove it?

In reply to SVreX:

We all know how that Hennesy Honda thing worked out, I think this may call for similar measures...

tuna55 wrote: Perhaps our resident hacker can gain access to her rarely-properly-secured webcam to prove it?

That would be illegal which SVreX's daughter doesn't want to do...it's also rather difficult, especially to do it stealthily.

WildScotsRacing wrote: In reply to fasted58: Good points. SVReX, it seems very likely that your daughter is not Cruella's first victim of this. If that is the case, all your daughter needs to do is stop responding entirely and behave as if it never happened and is not happening. Cruella will become bored with your daughter's lack of response and move on to her next victim.

Good word.

I think the game just changed from figuring out how to reason with a sociopath to trying to figure out how to keep unlimited creepy CL sex addicts at bay.